Re-Installing My Supercharger
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Gadget
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The front sensors on the 1GR are used primarily for closed loop mixture feed back control.
The rear sensors have many functions. The most important is they are used to health check the front sensors and are used to recalibrate the front sensors. Toyota uses a complex strategy of running the fuel mixture richer at times and leaner at times and the ECU looks for a specific reaction from the rear sensors to verify things are working correctly.
The rear sensors are used for verifying DSFO on shifting and deceleration. Anyway the ECU heavily uses those rear sensors for a LOT of things and it seem Toyota trusts those rear sensor more than they do the front ones.
I know there are a lot of people out there that will want to debate this, but very simply I am right and they are wrong. We have tons of data to back it up from our UCON development program.
G
The rear sensors have many functions. The most important is they are used to health check the front sensors and are used to recalibrate the front sensors. Toyota uses a complex strategy of running the fuel mixture richer at times and leaner at times and the ECU looks for a specific reaction from the rear sensors to verify things are working correctly.
The rear sensors are used for verifying DSFO on shifting and deceleration. Anyway the ECU heavily uses those rear sensors for a LOT of things and it seem Toyota trusts those rear sensor more than they do the front ones.
I know there are a lot of people out there that will want to debate this, but very simply I am right and they are wrong. We have tons of data to back it up from our UCON development program.
G
Dave at Alpine has updated the design of the intake plenum according to my request to house four intercooler cores. That should provide ample charge air cooling for any boost.
Four cores with air guides:
The plenum design with four cores:
I have a good feeling about this setup; I feel it will be much more efficient than air-to-air intercooling and takes much less space.
Also, I have removed the chip that the tuner put for me, which is way too simple and very limited in capabilities, and wired in the latest version of the PerfectPower SMT8, V4. The new version seems quite impressive on paper. If anything goes wrong with tuning, I don't think it would be because of the chip, it could be because of improper wiring and lack of sensors.
Gadget, do you use a MAP sensor in your kit? Seems having a MAP sensor can improve the tuning significantly.
Four cores with air guides:
The plenum design with four cores:
I have a good feeling about this setup; I feel it will be much more efficient than air-to-air intercooling and takes much less space.
Also, I have removed the chip that the tuner put for me, which is way too simple and very limited in capabilities, and wired in the latest version of the PerfectPower SMT8, V4. The new version seems quite impressive on paper. If anything goes wrong with tuning, I don't think it would be because of the chip, it could be because of improper wiring and lack of sensors.
Gadget, do you use a MAP sensor in your kit? Seems having a MAP sensor can improve the tuning significantly.
Gadget
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Water to air charge air cooler really are not more efficient than air to air in general. Where you do see water system that are more efficient is in short term use drag racing. In those applications ice and other chemicals are used in a tank and it is possible to get the charge air leaving the cooler at a lower temp the ambient. In this case they can be more than 100% efficient, but that does not last long at all. I ran an ice tank on my E55 and all that ice would be gone after each run.
In road vehicle use they generally are not more efficient than air/air systems. The reason is simple, the charge air has to transfer heat into the water, then the system pipes the water to a radiator where it has to give up that heat to the air. Each time it has to transfer the heat to a different medium you are loosing efficiency.
The biggest reason you see most supercharger companies using water/air systems is for packaging more than anything else. You can build the core into the design and make a smaller more compact installation. It is also easier to run a hose than a large pipe out to the font of the vehicle or where ever your radiator is. The other downside is heat soak. Once you use up the reserve capacity of the intercooler system that water gets real hot and takes a while to cool down again. There are few systems that can be run at 100% continuously and keep the charge temps in line.
The BIG air/air we use on the Tacoma works great. It is way over sized. I have beat on it like crazy on the race track and the charge temps stay very cool. The water system we used on the Mark 1 system did not keep up as well and we are pushing an additional 150+ HP.
There is a funny video around somewhere of a dyno run with a URD Mk2 system on a Tacoma and Grumpy touches the end tank on the hot side and burns his hand after the dyno run. The other side stays cool to the touch.
The UCON-Ethos is current setup to run off of the MAF sensor. This gives a much more accurate measure of the amount of air by mass entering the engine. There are provisions to connect a MAP sensor and we do plan on making it to run on MAP only. I think MAF is much better than MAP, but there are some packaging issues that can be a problem with custom turbo setups.
G
In road vehicle use they generally are not more efficient than air/air systems. The reason is simple, the charge air has to transfer heat into the water, then the system pipes the water to a radiator where it has to give up that heat to the air. Each time it has to transfer the heat to a different medium you are loosing efficiency.
The biggest reason you see most supercharger companies using water/air systems is for packaging more than anything else. You can build the core into the design and make a smaller more compact installation. It is also easier to run a hose than a large pipe out to the font of the vehicle or where ever your radiator is. The other downside is heat soak. Once you use up the reserve capacity of the intercooler system that water gets real hot and takes a while to cool down again. There are few systems that can be run at 100% continuously and keep the charge temps in line.
The BIG air/air we use on the Tacoma works great. It is way over sized. I have beat on it like crazy on the race track and the charge temps stay very cool. The water system we used on the Mark 1 system did not keep up as well and we are pushing an additional 150+ HP.
There is a funny video around somewhere of a dyno run with a URD Mk2 system on a Tacoma and Grumpy touches the end tank on the hot side and burns his hand after the dyno run. The other side stays cool to the touch.
The UCON-Ethos is current setup to run off of the MAF sensor. This gives a much more accurate measure of the amount of air by mass entering the engine. There are provisions to connect a MAP sensor and we do plan on making it to run on MAP only. I think MAF is much better than MAP, but there are some packaging issues that can be a problem with custom turbo setups.
G
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BrotherMurderface
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I like reading all this.....keep talkin G
I second Murderface (huh); I prefer a air-to-air actually; efficiency aside, I believe it has less things to go wrong; no water pump, no water leakage problems (though you can have a worse air leak). But the compactness is unbeatable in a water-to-air system.
The intake and air guides are all built now, just waiting on the intercooler cores. Seems there's a strike at the post office company in South Africa and no shipments are arriving. I'm hoping and praying the strike gets over soon, so I can have my intake ready and shipped to me. Now how unlucky is that?
Also I have been reading on the 1GR sensors and wiring diagrams, and I found that according to Toyota, the front sensors are wideband sensors, but the rear ones are actually narrow band. I was glad to read that because had they been also widebands, it would be impossible to control all four with one piggyback engine management system. Toyota calls the wideband sensors "A/F sensor" and the narrow band sensor "Heated oxygen sensor".
Also I have been reading on the 1GR sensors and wiring diagrams, and I found that according to Toyota, the front sensors are wideband sensors, but the rear ones are actually narrow band. I was glad to read that because had they been also widebands, it would be impossible to control all four with one piggyback engine management system. Toyota calls the wideband sensors "A/F sensor" and the narrow band sensor "Heated oxygen sensor".
The strike lasted about three months. I think it is about to end now, but they have so much parcels piled up, millions and millions of them, I have no idea when my cores will be arriving to be assembled in my intake. BAD LUCK!
I bought a 90 mm pulley for the Rotrex from URD. I'm thinking as long as I'm fitting all those coolers, I should get proper power. 90 mm, with a 175 mm drive pulley, should give me around 0.5 bar of boost; that's about 7.5 PSI. That's more than enough for me.
I bought a 90 mm pulley for the Rotrex from URD. I'm thinking as long as I'm fitting all those coolers, I should get proper power. 90 mm, with a 175 mm drive pulley, should give me around 0.5 bar of boost; that's about 7.5 PSI. That's more than enough for me.
There is some news that things are started to move in South Africa. Finally a tracking number for the cores being delivered to the intake manufacturer, to be assembled into the intake. Once it's assembled, I'll have him send it via DHL or something; not to use SA Post Office service.
Finally received the intake manifold! :rofl: This took so much time; originally anticipated to take only one month, but due to that South Africa strike it took five months. Damn!
The new intake, finally between my hands, so excited I didn't wait to open the box:
The intercooler cores with air guides shown from the intake:
So now I'm all excited to fit it. I received the 90 mm pulley from URD, and couldn't wait to install it right after I got back from the US:
Now to get the missing stuff (as usual):
1. Vacuum ports fittings
2. Some RTV sealant
3. Thread the elbow pipe holes for the throttle body. Dave forgot to thread the holes.
The new intake, finally between my hands, so excited I didn't wait to open the box:
The intercooler cores with air guides shown from the intake:
So now I'm all excited to fit it. I received the 90 mm pulley from URD, and couldn't wait to install it right after I got back from the US:
Now to get the missing stuff (as usual):
1. Vacuum ports fittings
2. Some RTV sealant
3. Thread the elbow pipe holes for the throttle body. Dave forgot to thread the holes.
I installed the new aluminum-cast intake a couple of days ago:
I had to battle a bit with one bolt hole in the intake plenum as there was a slight deformity in the casting at that screw location which cased it to go into the threaded hole at a slight angle, so the threads couldn't get aligned. I tapered the tip of the screw a bit and grounded off the thickness of the screw head with a bench grinder, until I was able to get the threads to go through. The rest of the screws and the two studs fitted perfectly.
I installed the elbow and throttle body last night; now everything is hooked up except the intercooler water hoses and plumbing; will take some pictures today at day time. I haven't started the engine yet, I'm a bit nervious worried that I'll find some vacuum leaks. Hope it goes well. Will post more pictures tonight.
I had to battle a bit with one bolt hole in the intake plenum as there was a slight deformity in the casting at that screw location which cased it to go into the threaded hole at a slight angle, so the threads couldn't get aligned. I tapered the tip of the screw a bit and grounded off the thickness of the screw head with a bench grinder, until I was able to get the threads to go through. The rest of the screws and the two studs fitted perfectly.
I installed the elbow and throttle body last night; now everything is hooked up except the intercooler water hoses and plumbing; will take some pictures today at day time. I haven't started the engine yet, I'm a bit nervious worried that I'll find some vacuum leaks. Hope it goes well. Will post more pictures tonight.
Redlantern
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Wow...Good stuff man!
I'm glad to report that the engine runs perfectly with the new intake, with no vacuum leaks.
I was frustrated about one thing. I was pumpbing the intercooler water hoses and after finishing everything, I found that my water pump is bad, after sitting in there for two years without use. So I have to drain all the coolant water and fix or buy a new pump.
Anyway, I'm just glad this intake is leak-free and the engine runs smoothly with it. Dave has done a very good job with it.
I was frustrated about one thing. I was pumpbing the intercooler water hoses and after finishing everything, I found that my water pump is bad, after sitting in there for two years without use. So I have to drain all the coolant water and fix or buy a new pump.
Anyway, I'm just glad this intake is leak-free and the engine runs smoothly with it. Dave has done a very good job with it.
